I'm not going to say Stone Free is a bad Stand (which I honestly feel it isn't), but I will say it isn't anything like the other Stands Jojos have. Restoration, Life Manipulation, Tusk's varying abilities, and Aspect Plundering. While it's similar to Star Platinum in physical ability, Star Platinum still has the power of Time Stop. Basically, while all other Jojos have Stands that affect things in a more supernatural degree - whether at first or eventually - Stone Free has strings. Furthermore, it feels to me that Araki really went out of his way to show what Stone Free was capable of to show just how powerful it is. With all the other Stands you don't need to really be shown much to understand they're all capable of many things, that they're powerful. Either way, what I'm asking is this; What's another ability Stone Free could have possessed that's more meta in it's function while still being versatile? A Stand power that's more typical of a Jojo Stand.
Again, I'm not saying I dislike Stone Free nor that it isn't a bad fit for a Jojo. I'm just curious what other's feel might be a power that'd be more along the same vein as other Jojos'.
|Posted by ImaFanMan on 18 May 2020 at 23:09.|
Edited by ImaFanMan on 19 May 2020 at 16:25.
I'm not the most creative or great at speculation but maybe some sort of ability tied to her strings where being caught in them is draining to the victim. Not in a vampiric kind of way but kind of like mental suggestion that can cause weaker people to become more inclined to relax and just kind of give up. Almost like a mental paralysis or lethargic state that weakens them. It could be more effective on weaker individuals like say Gwess but scale as the series goes on. I imagine stronger characters like Pucci, Johngalli A, and Lang Rangler being more perceptive and able to resist but still on the alert for that power. I feel like it could lead to some interesting fights and concepts but I don't know how much you can do with that concept.
|Posted by Watayahotel98 on 19 May 2020 at 02:46.|
Something else that recently came to mind is the ability to duplicate herself or Stone Free. This would allow her to send copys of her for distraction, reconnaissance, or just to gang up on an enemy and pummel them. It could work like Proletariat in Sentinels of the Multiverse where the more copys they make, the less mentally powerful and focused these copys become. (i.e. If there are a hundred of her she has tons of physical power but the copys act like frenzied ants, not knowing what to do or having the mental drive that Jolyne has) This way her power isn't totally broken but she may learn to control more amounts of focused copies as Stone Ocean goes on. This is like D4C in that she can have multiples of herself, but it's much less powerful and has more consequences. I also feel like this could lead to interesting (albeit confusing) fights, maybe Pucci knows that when she's injured duplicating herself is risky and takes a lot of strength but she does so anyway to get the drop on him. Or Whitesnake is able to disguise himself as a copy of Stone Free/Jolyne in the midst of battle and it leads to a "who's the real one?" situation where Anasui has to prove he truly knows Jolyne and can choose the right one and avoid being destroyed by Pucci. I feel like there are a lot of pros and cons to the ability and in Araki's capable hands we could see some really cool stuff.
|Posted by Watayahotel98 on 19 May 2020 at 15:13.|
After thinking about it a bit myself, I've got the idea of "instead of literal physical strings, what about metaphorical strings?" What about strings that, say, represent something abstract like fate/destiny (e.g., someone's impending death, an encounter between two people, etc.) and Stone Free could interact with said strings, manipulating them or even severing them. To balance this, she can only make an educated guess what fate each string represents by "feeling" the fate tied to it and the color of the string. Maybe a red string means something violent happens and when Stone Free grabs it Jolyne feels like she's been hit extremely hard in the gut. Later, the person who was connected to said string dies or at least is seriously injured by being shot in the stomach. Another way of her figuring out what's tied to the string would be to have her get brief and cryptic glimpses of the event or simply get a subtle understanding of it, like a sixth sense. She simply knows. Furthermore, she could probably deuce what event the strings are tied to by seeing who's tied to the string. She could then make educated guesses from there. Later on she could even advance the ability to allow her to create entirely new strings. Though, I'd imagine you'd have to limit this by making it so she'd only be able to do this to someone without a string already tied to them, or she can create the string and tie it up to who/whatever she wants, but what event happens between them is completely random and out of her hands, making it a bit of a gamble. Also, I'd imagine these "Destiny Strings" would based around events of the near future. Maybe she could also develop the ability to at least see strings that tie into future or even past events, but maybe only see them, not actually manipulate them. After all, if she saw Pucci's future of obtaining Made In Heaven, she could just cut that string and be done with it.
I'm sure there are other ways of doing this, aside from destiny strings. Maybe it could be emotional, *maybe "the strings that keep the world together" (no, not quantum strings, though I do think those could also be a decent alternative), maybe strings through time, idk. You could go on. Overall, the only thing with these abilities is they still correlate to strings. When it comes down to a completely original ability, I've yet to come up with anything. Still, they work as different, more supernatural takes on "string" abilities.
*To further elaborate on what I meant, I got the idea of "maybe strings that keep buildings from falling apart, or that give the human body it's mobility and strength and severing those strings is like severing the strings of a well-wound doll, causing it to go limp and with function". It's not as personally intriguing to me as the first idea, but I think it's still got potential. Such as Jolyne being able to - as I mentioned - severe someone's ability to move, or causing a building to collapse, maybe even severing the link between and Stand and it's user.
|Posted by ImaFanMan on 19 May 2020 at 20:39.|
Posted by Watayahotel98 on 19 May 2020 at 15:13.»Something else that recently came to mind is the ability to duplicate herself or Stone Free. This would allow her to send copys of her for distraction, reconnaissance, or just to gang up on an enemy and pummel them. It could work like Proletariat in Sentinels of the Multiverse where the more copys they make, the less mentally powerful and focused these copys become. (i.e. If there are a hundred of her she has tons of physical power but the copys act like frenzied ants, not knowing what to do or having the mental drive that Jolyne has) This way her power isn't totally broken but she may learn to control more amounts of focused copies as Stone Ocean goes on. This is like D4C in that she can have multiples of herself, but it's much less powerful and has more consequences. I also feel like this could lead to interesting (albeit confusing) fights, maybe Pucci knows that when she's injured duplicating herself is risky and takes a lot of strength but she does so anyway to get the drop on him. Or Whitesnake is able to disguise himself as a copy of Stone Free/Jolyne in the midst of battle and it leads to a "who's the real one?" situation where Anasui has to prove he truly knows Jolyne and can choose the right one and avoid being destroyed by Pucci. I feel like there are a lot of pros and cons to the ability and in Araki's capable hands we could see some really cool stuff.
I actually really like this idea. It could be used for many situations and could definitely lead to some interesting situations, such as the one you demonstrated. Another possible way to nerf the power would be to, say, make it so they didn't have intelligence to begin with, only being able to act by Stone Free's command. But the more clones there are of Jolyne, the harder it is for Stone Free to actively control them. Or you could simply have it where there's a set limit to the amount of clones she can have, her clones are overall weaker than Jolyne, it takes time to produce them, or there's some kind of catalyst, like Stone Free can only transmute materials (maybe stone?) into clones of her. The only other options I can think of are maybe her clones have a will of their own, or she somehow has to actively keep them under her control or else they'll rebel and the idea of maybe they have no memories (e.g., how to fight, who their friends are, etc.) other then the knowledge of who they are, "Jolyne Kujo". That last one, unless you tweak it properly, probably wouldn't be the best pick, but it's there. Going back to its capabilities; what about it being able to clones others, as well? Also, would these clones have Stands themselves? That would be a bit overpowered, so probably not. I would say she could also clone objects, but I think that's when the power would become too similar to Kiss', so that's also a probable hard pass. I mentioned possibly transmuting objects into Jolyne. What if that's expanded further into "Stone Free can transmute one thing, into another"? What if that's the case? If so, then Jolyne can transmute herself into Ermes and vice versa. Or - if a function it's capable of - turn Stone Free into Kiss and the reverse.
Either way, however this power works, I like it and think it'd be really interesting if it was a power in the main series. Jolyne could've used it in some interesting ways and overall it's more supernatural than simply "strings". The only issues there would be for it as a Jojo ability would lie in is it too limited or powerful? Which, again, there's many ways you could limit it or expand it. Overall, if made to be still quite versatile but not too powerful, then it'd be a great power for her to have.
|Posted by ImaFanMan on 19 May 2020 at 22:15.|
I like the "Fate Strings" idea to an extent but for me it gets a little too close to the "chosen one" feeling. The Joestars have always been the chosen ones of their stories but to me they feel more like "the versatile ones" or people who possess an incredible power and are unique because they come up with endless ways to use their abilities. Whether they're winning or losing, they usually give of a sense of mastery or control over their ability that gives them the edge in the end. With Fate Strings, it may feel like Jolyne's powers control her rather than her mastering and controlling them. It may take away her autonomy as a character and could make her feel weaker or less in control of the situations. Or alternatively, having absolute control over fates could give move her in a villainous direction or give her a darker turn as a Joestar. I think someone more creative than me could definitely do something with this, but it would be very tough to make the story feel original and fresh. I don't think it's a bad idea at all, I just know I wouldn't know where to take a story where we see both the idea of fate playing out and being manipulated as a power.
Regardless I think it's fun to think of different ideas for Jolyne or Joestar powers and I'd love to hear more! They've got a very specific feel to them and their versatility what really drew me into the series. It's a great idea for discussion.
|Posted by Watayahotel98 on 21 May 2020 at 17:41.|
Yeah, after thinking about it a bit more, I've come to the realization it might be way too overpowered to properly use. Not unless you greatly limit it. I agree that it's the cleverness of Jojos that make them really good characters, so having a Stand like this really would lose that affect, even if nerfed. The implications of it are too extreme and there's no real way I can think of that'd limit it's power enough to the point where it's still a good ability, but not too great. Maybe there's an angle I'm missing, but as far as I can tell this isn't the best option. When I first thought of it, I knew it was pretty powerful, but thought there could be ways to limit it creatively. But, now I realize that might not be the case. I'll continue to ponder it, but as of writing this, the "Fate Strings" idea is - as you mentioned - better for a villain or something. Not a Jojo protagonist.
So I went back to square one and tried to come up with a new idea. This time one that didn't revolve around "strings". That's when I remembered an idea I came up with some time ago. Basically, what if Stone Free's name correlated to its ability a bit more? I know it's meant to be symbolic for how Jolyne want to "be free of this Stone Ocean" and all that, but what ability its ability as well? What if Stone Free's ability is to turn solid objects into a liquid form and vice versa? And by liquid form, I don't mean turning ice into a liquid makes it water, it turns it into it's liquid form. Same goes for water becoming solid; solid water isn't a block of ice, it's simply solid water. This would actually be an interesting ability and could pave the way for a more Jojo-esc ability. It isn't outright powerful like most others, but it's certainly an unusual one that could achieve unique affects. What exactly it could be capable of can vary, but here are some random ideas I've come up with; Jolyne could turn herself completely into a liquid, allowing her to move around quickly, slip through cracks, even enter people's bodies (if she really wanted to) and evade attacks. Turn the floor of an entire area into a liquid, causing everyone to sink in and then re-solidifying it, trapping them. Partially liquefy Stone Free to make her harder to hit while not losing her combative capabilities. Solidify a liquid into an shape she wants, be it a liquefied solid or not (and this applies to both objects and people). Merge liquids together to solidify them into an amalgamated piece (e.g. merge two Stands/people together) and then re-liquefy them to separate them (this could also be used to transfer things like diseases or heal wounds). Split off a liquefied object and then re-solidify it to form multiple smaller versions of the original objects (e.g. many mini Jolynes). And liquefy a portion of a wall, walk through it, then re-solidify the wall. Those are just the examples I could come up with after thinking about it briefly. I'm certain there are many more ways this ability could be used.
Now, as for how exactly it works and what it's weaknesses are, that's more up in the air. Maybe Stone Free simply has to touch the object to liquefy it. But, for sentient targets like humans, the only way Stone Free can liquefy/solidify them is if they either want Stone Free to liquefy/solidify them or if Stone Free manages to force them. Maybe if you don't want the ability to affect you, it won't really work, but Stone Free can still barrage you, with each fist forcing small portions of your body to transmute until all of you is completely solid/liquid. Also, on the subject of humans, we are comprised of both solids and liquids. So, for objects that are constructed like that, it'd be more complicated for Stone Free to turn them into an outright liquid or solid. Then there's also the worry of, say, losing your blood or water when in liquid form. Also, there's the thought of could becoming completely liquid or solid lead to death? Or does your body still function like it normally would, just, in a different way? Or do we just hand wave that? (lol) You'd also have to consider gases as well as transmuted liquids and solids. I'd guess gases couldn't be interacted with, but maybe she'd develop the ability to achieve that. Try to imagine solid or liquid fire or lightning. That'd be interesting to see used in a fight. As for manipulation, maybe limited and only for liquids or transmuted objects with no will? Maybe Stone Free or Jolyne have to be actively touching them to manipulate them. This would help with returning liquefied objects to their original form or turning them into something new. But the moment the physical contact is lost, so is the control with the only means of regaining it being to simply touch it again. The final thing to address I can think of at the moment would be; how does this ability affect Stands? I listed an example that directly affected Stone Free, but I was just brainstorming possibilities then. Maybe it could be possible to liquefy a Stand and not the user and vice versa. Maybe that's something Jolyne could pull. "If I can't liquefy you, then I'll liquefy your Stand!" But, would completely liquefying someone's Stand matter? If it's a potential danger doing that to someone, then I'd say it should also be potentially harmful to liquefy a Stand. But, if not, then there shouldn't be any issue. But then I'm brought to; what even is a Stand? A solid, a liquid, or something else entirely? After all, Stands are supernatural entities. So, should Stone Free even be able to affect them in the first place? Another thing to consider would be whether not Stands keep the same form if their user is turn to a liquid. Does the Stand then take on a more liquid form or can the Stand even manifest in the first place? I'm kind of jumping all over the place here, I know, but these are still things that need to be considered for a power like this.
Well, there's my new idea. I think it's better than my previous, but I'm not sure myself how'd you tweak it to be more detailed. I'm not sure what limits and strengths Araki would give it. But, still, it should be much more appropriate then Fate Strings. Still look forward to other potential ideas as I'm sure there are other fitting powers for Jolyne.
PS: The name I came of with for this ability is; "Solid-Liquid Transmutation". Not the best but it's a working name.
|Posted by ImaFanMan on 24 May 2020 at 19:34.|